History Repeating

Iran strike - second stage planning

Correct Title: Senior intel official: Pentagon moves to second-stage planning for Iran strike option
URL: http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Pentagon_moves_to_secondstage_planning_for_0921.html

Other good sources for get the lowdown on the impending Iran attack are Seymour Hersh and Scott Ritter.

"brainwashed by Bush" - there is at least one critical flaw in that statement and probably a few others.

That second-stage article is three months old.

Is Bush mad/desperate enough to attack Iran (given that any coherent post-attack analysis sees a major boost for theocrats and setback for the reformers who seem to be doing quite well, thank you)? Probably. Can he? No, not in any meaningful sense, he hasn't got a spare army (quibbling over 20,000 troops for Baghdad suggests to me that he's broken his toy soldiers already. Air raids, despite what the flyboys say, have been comprehensively proven a bust in Iraq and Lebanon, in terms of actually destroying your enemy. As ways of pissing off the (surviving) locals and forcing them to support your enemy, they work brilliantly.

Which leaves the nukes. The consequences of nuking Iran are almost certainly widespread rebellion in friendly countries. So much for Blair's 'moderate' alliance, then.

I want my country back.

Interesting timing all this, just as Iran has announced that it is to shift its foreign currency reserves from dollars to euros and use the euro for oil deals.

The BBC News article of 18/12/06 (linked above) describes Iran's move as 'widely expected' (remember the fuss about Iran's proposed (remember the Iranian Oil Bourse of which this move may be the precursor).

Iran's move will threaten to collapse the fragile arrangement of US Oildollar hegemony, (which incidentaly props up the US's $8.6 Trillion Public Debt), just as Saddam Hussain/Iraq switched to Euros for oil sales in late 2000, creating the real reason for the Invasion of Iraq.

The real reason that Margaret Becket was alluding to but couldn't say on the R4 Today Programme interview this week, when challenged with Carne Ross's statement that "at no time did HMG [Her Majesty's Government] assess that Iraq's WMD posed a threat to the UK or its interests."

It was Nigeria's switch to the Dollar that created the run on the pound all those years ago

History repeating, we are seeing exactly the same propaganda campaign as in 02/03.

WMD and "intentions of genocide" too

I posted at the end of last week hearing the drumbeat speed up in our frogmedia, Elie Wiesel and others in full swing, preceding Bibi's conference this tuesday. Coordinated without a doubt.

Hillary Clinton in full cry, so much for november's US election results, and hopes of peace.

Sink, you know what the say about "lies, damn lies and stats", maybe the hole is much bigger than USD 8 trillion or so . Having experienced a few interesting times in the markets, crash of 87 etc, they were bad, but a run on the $ would be armageddon.

Gabriel Kolko (counterpunch) on the derivatives market worth a look , sorry no link, gotta get outside to the woodpile.

I just can't listen to/watch Blair anymore without the words 'F***off,F***off,F***off!!!' springing unbidden to my lips. Especially upon watching his mad-as-a-barrel-o-monkeys-on-acid performance this morning, dribbling on about the `threat` from Iran. So tell me, your lowness, how many countries has Iran invaded? Oh, none, right....and how many nuclear-powered/armed warfleets does Iran have roaming the seas? Er, none. And how many squadrons of Iranian deathmissile-armed planes and bombers are poised to descend upon Britain and/or our allies? Heck, none, I believe, is the answer!

Yeah, we all know how the logic goes - UK/US invades Iraq for no good reason, kills 100s of thousands and wrecks the entire nation, and Israel does the same thing for pretty much similar reasons. And yet Iran is a THREAT.

And Jade Goodey is the reincarnation of Joan of Arc!

The "hole" is a lot bigger than $8.6 trillion as they do not accrue for future obligations, for example Medicare, Medicaid and social security which are about to become very significant as the baby boomers start to retire. The true figure is more like $50 trillion. oops

Bibi

Hilary - Zionist puppet?

Tone hinted long ago

"Tone hinted" --- that Times article also went into selective quoting... one para from a whole speech, fuckin typical.

Middle-eastern speechifying is full of hyperbole and fancy stuff which can grate on our ears, but don't mean much. MAD applies to all, and Pdt "A" is not the Persian equivalent of a "nuke'em" redneck .

( Comparing, Blair Bush Condi Bibi and Co would scare the shit out of me if I were down there, load of actual warmongers AND WARMAKERS. Let alone that, they do so up here. )

I had a look at the different translations a year ago, obvious he was talking about the regime, comparing it to the Soviet one. juan cole et al.

Can't be bothered to search again, just to post and see it drop off the page.

Maybe BW could look and post links up permanent- like ?

It would save the frustration of seeing the same MSM - constructed miscnceptions recurring indefinitely.

its not it's - for the 100th time. Raise your game, Blairwatch.

I'm choking back the vomit again, certainly when I try to imagine what place Blair has in an alliance of moderation in the region and outside of it to defeat the extremists

I mean let's face it When he's also stating :A large part of world opinion is frankly almost indifferent. It would be bizarre if it weren't deadly serious I am forced to want to point out to him that this actually puts him in a minority in every sense as extreme as the people he is purporting to be fighting his little good fight against. One of the overriding points in comments such as these is that we end up trying to define 'moderation' I mean are are the states moderate when they put people to death by electrocution (rather than hanging them from goal posts), is Mugabe moderate for starving those that oppose him to death, is China moderate for just plain shooting people in the back of the head, are we moderate for closing hospitals in areas that don't vote Labour? What is moderate? Is Blair moderate for invading sovereign states in order that they can become part of the Blair vision of moderation. Do we as a nation have the military and financial capacity to impose Blairs vision of moderation on other nations?
This really has gone too far, he really has lost all sense of reality, he really believes that he has the answers to the issues of the middle east despite so badly screwing up all attempts so far.
It would be bizarre if it weren't deadly serious.

legion-- one quibble !

in every sense as extreme as the people he is purporting to be fighting his little good fight against.

Of course your point about double-standarded hypocritical-moralising interventionism is correct. GWB has 2.3mio in prison, TB leads europe with 80,000.They are both crims.

I carry no water (us-speak) for Ahmad**** who runs a foul regime ,(normal for the ME and north africa and more) but the situation there is highly complex and changing.

This thread questions whether BushBlair are "going for bust", and I'm going to be really boring in asking you and the rest to check out some facts. Excuses if you personally have already done this .

Some of the basic premisses of the propaganda campaign are very widely accepted . Everyday I meet people who sincerely believe the MAN threatened genocide against Israel.

I sometimes forget my english, is it diabolisation or demonisation ?

My friends, some of them real lifelong "lefties", have been bombarded with this DEVIL stuff x times a day for a year now, and some now believe it !

I think it was september 2005 when TV3 here announced on the 23hrs news that Iran was building nukes. No "allegedly" ....

My quibble ? I don't believe Blair is as extreme as Ahmadinejihad, I think he's far more extreme .

I have just read this flyingimam where if it is true (can anybody source this? ) it gives an interesting insight.

God help us. Any incident with Iran is going to be a real *real* mess; particularly for the Americans. The entire 5th fleet sits in the Gulf; currently being bolstered with other vessels; minesweepers and such presumably for keeping the shipping lanes open if anything were to happen; and is very vunerable.
The Iranian might have a crackpot leader but they are armed to the teeth with
the best missile technology that money can buy. Not talking dated, slow French
Excocet rubbish (tho reportedly they have 300+) but the Sunburn 22
(Raduga Moskit) missile, a wepon that has a top speed of Mach 2.5, range 90
miles and is generally considered to be unstopable; and they have hundred of them hidden in the mountains surrounding the gulf along with the more current
Yakhonts 26 missile. The threat posed by just these wepons cannot be
underestimated. At such high speed 20ft from the water it carries out violent manovers before impact to counteract any anti missile defence system
and there is no defense a ship can muster to defeat it. This wepon was
specifically designed to defeat American Phalanx defense system and
presumably the Rolling Action Missile (RAM) system. Cast your mind back to
the Faulkland conflict; its success or faliure rested largly on how many
Excoct missiles the Argentinians actually has (5 ish?). The Navy knew how
vunerable the whole fleet was to anti ship missiles and all these years on
its not changed. Were the defense systems to work they would simply be
overwhelmed by the number of missiles that would be launched if a full out
attack were to happen.

jono

Pearl Harbor II, or Tonkin Gulf , or USS Maine, of course Bush would love an accident to happen.

(Now what was the name of that Iranian artillery officer with the sister in the US, who would do anything for 10 million bucks ?
That would 'explain' gas at $10, and all those other delightful local things we've been planning. )

Ever so slightly more seriously, I'd like the source too, Eh Up . Blair works for Israel first ?, your link, my comment ,

The US debate about AIPAC-- the major Zionist lobby in the States, is almost beginning to get serious, Soros doin stuff recently, link to follow, but it ain't yet started in my old england and this frogland.

When I was a young soldier long ago, I'm sure there was something , some law, against enlisting in foreign armies. Foreign Enlistments Act ? off to google.

PS edit, in canada you cannot RECRUIT, but volunteering is OK. Rather like the Brit laws on prostitution. No google-luck so far on the UK .

jono that is why it is so serious. I think we all have a good idea how this could end up if the crazies or ultra hard Zionists get their way. It is scary. I look at Israeli news sites and "user comments" and it is clear many are terrified of Iran. That is probably due to the kind of propaganda that is briefly mentioned in this video of ex IDF guys who have chosen to speak out (assuming it is genuine)

Breaking the silence

Hiya frog, I have not seen any Soros stuff on the Israeli lobby so please do provide details if you can. Thanks.

I would not be surprised if peeps here know all about it but you can get a brief intoduction to this from Paul Findley:

Paul Findley

eh up,

I think I've sourced the quote you mentioned. It is here in The Times.

Merci Davide,Very Wicked article from Kaletsky there !

what I was going to post, plus rsponse to Eh Up video ---

TB --

"Elements of the government of Iran [are] openly supporting terrorism in Iraq, trying to turn out a democratically elected government in Lebanon, flouting the international community's desire for peace in Palestine at the same time as denying the Holocaust and trying to acquire nuclear weapons capability," Mr Blair said. He could have gone on - and he did"

Well exsoldier frog 'understands' movements of national liberation,whether or not actually "openly" supported by Iran

Lebanese remaining gov are globalising pro-US stooges

"Flouting" peace in Palestine
( while denying the popular vote----"the Chileans voted wrong way"-- henry kissinger NOBEL PEACEPRIZE WINNER, so there ! )

denying the Holocaust --
(No he didn't you wanker)

trying to get nukes capability
( unproven, not all that likely, and anyway far-off, shithead)

So I'm obviously not a Blair moderate.

AND

Eh Up -- awesome stuff indeed. Brit Daily mirror showed fake photos of brit soldiers torturing, editor fired, later the truth mirrored the fake. This is different.

This material is 100% convincing to me. It confirms what I have read from innumerable sources-- other Israeli ex-soldiers and citizens, real veterans of many Israeli wars. Plus the unusual journalists who do their job properly.

Former Senator Abourezk recently confirmed from the inside how much AIPAC is hated and feared inside Congress.

Here is the link to Soros The Other Israeli lobby

He's a a seemingly luvly man, but armslength advised,

Tony the 'Trocious's "Peace in Palestine" refers to the situation when either the Palestinains have ever given up hope and effort to recover their land OR, when they have all been silened from genocide.

That's what the Satan from Sedgefield understands by peace. You can see his peace efforts in many parts of the world.

This man must be prosecuted and punished accordingly, for his muliptle and most deadly evil crimes.

Jaw Jaw rather than War War ...

Happy 'Whatever' to all, off for a coupla days.

How the hell Blair can say stuff like this: "Here are elements of the government of Iran openly supporting terrorism in Iraq to stop a fledgling democratic process, trying to turn out a democratic government in Lebanon, flouting the international community’s desire for peace in Palestine at the same time as [denying the Holocaust], and trying to [acquire nuclear weapon capability]".... and not see the hypocrisy in his own actions in the region is absolutely totally beyond me. Crap, he's just mimicking the Whitehouse. WTF! so we are just another appendage of the Americana/Zionist agenda, it all adds up, all makes sense; and we sleep-walked right into it!

And all the while Israeli's act like the SS... fukn hypocrites!!!!!

Makes me feel like crushing his (Blairs) tiny hands...